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11.06.09, 11:27 AM
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It's like being Catholic during the priest scandal or black any time Al Sharpton opens his mouth.
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Too funny. I do often cringe whenever he opens his mouth.
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I agree. And also, I feel a little for the shooter, who must have been going through something terrible, who must have been so terrified of being deployed that he thought this was his best option.
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are you serious? this is a joke right? his best option was to shoot and kill people? hmmmm----
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that is not what she said. she did not say "his best option was to shoot and kill people." she is talking about the kind of mental abyss someone may enter that would prompt them to commit such an awful act
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Then he should'nt have enlisted in the military.
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do you know how many people turn nutty after joining the military. please.
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The man was never even deployed. I'd say he had some issues and that they had nothing to do with the military.
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Do you also feel this way about suicide bombers?
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np: they are all screwed up in the head one way or another.
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Yes, our foreign policy would be a heckuva lot more effective if we looked at why people do things.
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Yep, blame the victim. Good thinking.
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Don't be dense. Nobody's blaming the victim by trying to understand what actually causes these things to happen rather than blasting everyone off to pieces. The world would be a better place without people like you making serious and complicated issues into evil vs good.
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I was happy to see at least two Muslim American groups issue statements denouncing his actions.
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Me too. Ironic that he worked for so many years helped people with post traumatic stress disorder, and now his actions have caused so much. Apparently he was an amazing psychiatrist.
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Given what he ultimately did, how can you say he was an amazing psychiatrist?
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Many people who have been treated by him, or worked with him, have been quoted as saying what a great doctor he was. He just snapped.
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np well duh, I think the irony was the point. His patients said he was an amazing psychiatrist. How can someone who never met him contradict that?
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news reports say that he had received bad performance reviews from the Army at multiple points in his career.
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That doesn't mean anything. The army hates having to treat PTSD.
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The maker of the upcoming apocalyptic film "2012" has conceded he enjoyed orchestrating the visual disintegration of the world's religious symbols, such as the Vatican and the famous statue of Jesus overlooking Rio de Janeiro.
But he left an Islamic symbol alone because he feared the reaction from the Muslim world. Roland Emmerich said he had considered including the destruction of the Kaaba, the cube-shaped structure in Mecca worshiped by Muslims as being built by Abraham and his son Ishmael.
"Well, I wanted to do that, I have to admit," Emmerich said. "But my co-writer Harald [Kloser] said I will not have a fatwa on my head because of a movie. And he was right. ... We have to all ... in the Western world ... think about this."
...
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Okay, did you put in all those ellipses? Because if so, I'd like to see the actual quote.
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Just do a search on "2012 movie emmerich kaaba" and you'll see it. Sorry to disturb your anti-western, anti-Judeo-Christian attitude.
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he definitely had issues that were not related to the military. he was very imbalanced and it's a real misfortune for the muslim community in our country. i pray that, as a country, that we do not overreact toward the community in general for one bad, bad egg.
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I feel worse for the VICTIMS of the shooting.
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33 replies
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11.05.09, 01:02 PM
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Friends who are international urban types and both WOH FT live in Weston and are happy and love the schools - kids are in later elementary school.
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^^^ oops, I meant Wellesley - I get my friends confused.
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I've also heard good things about Wellesley.
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how adaptable are you? how good are you with change? Hingham has a great school system.
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OP- Uh semi-adaptable? I'm already transitioning from a WOHM to SAHM. DH's new job involves a big raise. Does Hingham have public transit? The MBTA website is crap.
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Hingham has a boat and a commuter rail. Excellent schools, adorable coastal town.
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Yes it does. My husband grew up in Hingham and his family is still there. I go there a few times a year and it's really very pleasant. It's also just a few minutes from a decent beach and the Harbor is pleasant. Lots of beautiful, historic homes.
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Hingham is lovely but it's the middle of nowhere. You would need two cars.
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it's 13 miles south of boston.
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Right. It's more than an hour outside of the city with no public transit unless you're want a 90 min commute. I grew up on the South Shore, I know where Hingham is.
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That's not true. You can take the train on the Greenbush line from two stops in Hingham, the ferry or a bus.
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Boston native here. Newton has the best public schools (arguably in the country) and is convenient for commute to city. If you want to be more "in" the city and not compromise good schools, I'd check out Brookline. Westwood is also a great place for families and a little less jappy than Newton. Wellesley is lovely, too. I see someone rec. that above.
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my sister lives in brookline...great schools...i like the vibe of being part urban part suburban there that nyc doesn't really have (maybe parts of queens or brooklyn are similar)
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ita with these two--Brookline and Newton. Wellesley and Weston and Hingham are nice but really, really suburban/far out. Brookline and Newton have great schools and nice walkable neighborhoods, good public trans. and they're not far at all from downtown Boston.
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np: don't know about newton, but brookline is expensive. many who move farther out into greater suburbia do it to get more space, nicer house, etc.
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True, but like everywhere else the cost is due to the great schools, ditto Newton. And Wellesley and Weston are both $$$. Acton is nice, pretty suburban/rural and the schools are terrific, but it may be further west than you want. I'd definitely come and have a look around--all of these places are very different. I just prefer someplace like Brookline where you're not in the car all the time and kids have more freedom to roam around on their own once they're middle-school age.
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brookline is a great place to raise kids, and newton would be too
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Milton is lovely and south of the city but close in, although I don't think it's got a commuter rail station.
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Depending on where you live in Milton, you can be near the Braintree stop on the redline. And yes, it is very nice place to live.
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Milton public schools aren't very good, though.
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That's what I've heard as well.
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South of boston: Hingham and Cohasset.
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I learned that you can be miserable in the most wonderful place if you aren't open to the change. If this is a move you have to make then be sure your head is in the game. Good luck!
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best post of the evening.
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OP- I'm sure we'll be fine. Yes, I have to move but it will be good for the family. It's what's best for my DH and DD. I'm just overwhelmed by the amount of research we have to do at the moment.
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Agree with the above if you want urban/suburban feel go with Newton or Brookline. Beautiful towns and excellent schools, a stone's throw from Boston, great restaurants, hospitals, etc.
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Why not downtown? There are schools there, private for the most part though one or two publics ok. Concord, Lexington, Belmont, Arlington...good schools, some of these towns are better than others. Hingham is a terrible commute. I kind of wonder if anyone recommending the South Shore actually lives there and works? Newton is ok, I disagree that the schools are the best in the state, and Newton is so big that the schools are variable. Brookline is appallingly expensive though I would say the schools are the best in the state. The commute in and out of Brookline is not great, especially on public transport though depends where you work. If you mentioned where DH was commuting to might be able to help better. But most of the close lying suburb...
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Places to live in Newton: City made up 13 villages--Waban, Chestnut Hill, West Newton Hill but there are other nice areas-->generally below the Pike and above Route 9. Below Route 9 has nice homes but it's a different vibe: way more suburdan, bus is only public transportation. Brookline is more urban. Newton is urban transitioning to suburban. As somebody said to me, if you have 1 kid, Brookline is OK. More than that, live in Newton. Newton schools are generally better than Brookline.
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OP- DH will probably be working in downtown (near South Station) for the most part but will also have an office in Quincy which is why I had initially said south.
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I live in Boston, DC goes to Boston public schools--it's been an uneven experience but not the nightmare that many make it out to be. It just depends on what kind of culture you're looking for and I'm not getting enough from your post. Where do you live now and what do you like about it? Are you a Brooklyn type or a UES type? And btw, you're right about the MBTA site--you might have better luck if you just Google places you're interested in and then look for the T or commuter rail.
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We're on UWS right now. Pretty crunchy for UWS, though. Love being able to walk everywhere. Looking forward to taking my DD to museums, parks, the library. If we can find a town/neighborhood with a few decent not chain restaurants that would be great. I hate the idea of needing two cars but I don't want to limit our search based on what might be irrational fears. We're going to Boston next weekend to look around. Where do you live? I thought the Boston publics were not an option for us but maybe...
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DH will be downtown near South Station 4 days a week and in Quincy one day a week.
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sorry for double post... first one didn't show up at first.
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3 replies
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11.07.09, 07:13 AM
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^ugh - meant "holiday gift".
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friend's dd has the Melissa & Doug one and it's survived 3-4 years.
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11.06.09, 08:08 PM
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Free Catholic HS for Catholic boys who pass a test to get in.
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thanks - is there religion in classs / school?
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uh, yes. it is a catholic school. even to take the entrance test you need to be a baptized catholic.
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You have to be a Catholic - baptized and confirmed.
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11.07.09, 04:51 AM
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Going to new playground at CPW and 100th. Make the most of the nice weather.
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11.07.09, 04:18 AM
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11.06.09, 03:20 PM
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My dd loves the Playtex ones where the nipple is made of silicone. They have the ages on them too such as 6 month+ and if you can find them get the Ortho Pro Playtex ones. These ones are made to not ruin their teeth.
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thanks! i will look tomorrow.
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I really had to work to get my dcs to take pacifiers. I found that it really is barely worth it at all because soon thereafter you have to wean them off them.
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sorry no real help, but for my DD she only likes a very specific swiss brand. it is totally and completely ridiculous. Just try one of every one you can get your hands on and try to make them soft first (boil as directed, and then squish them with your fingers, etc.)
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(or) my DD prefers the orthopedic shape as well
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i mean orthodontic. long long week...
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op: lol, it's fine :) she'll take them when in her carrier outside but not inside. oh well.
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Soothies
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op: tried them, no dice.
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Just as well, I threw mine out at six mos and DS is pacifier free
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op: on one hand i'm happy to not have to wean her, but our bed time "ritual" is her falling asleep on the breast and lying there for about 20 mins before i can put her in her bed. i wonder if i can get her to take a pacifier if it would help someone else put her to bed.
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Lol. As we speak 13 mo DS is asleep on me after nursing and I'm waiting to put him down. My iPhone keeps me sane. I learned to enjoy this quiet time to chk email or UB
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what i do but on my sidekick!! glad to know i'm not alone :)
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You are not alone (I've moved to standing by crib rubbing his back). A month ago I posted on UB frustrated for one night off. Then I figured if DH is putting DB to bed then I have to walk the dog. Nah, much rather UB and nurse
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Btw, I just left and DS cried for 30 to 45 seconds and fell asleep. So rest assured it won't always be a long event!
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whoot!
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off breast, now sleeping on shoulder. letting her rest on me while watching dvr'd flashforward with dh.
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Sounds relaxing. Also sounds like you're doing just fine. GL!
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11.06.09, 05:03 PM
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Enjoy it while you can
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ditto!
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ita. you're smart to understand that this is the start of endless babyproofing/babychasing. save your energy!
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DS walked at 14 months 3 weeks. I refused to help him, I knew he would learn on his own, and if we got to 18 months and weren't close, I'd get him any help/therapy he needed. My DH and I fought about this, and he said I'm a horrible mother for not teaching DS how to walk. Walking is taught, blah, blah, blah. Anyway, DS is now two and very happy and healthy and runs all over.
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My friend once said "Once your child is walking your butt becomes a trampoline. Every time you go to sit down you have to get right back up to stop them from getting into everything. My dd doesn't sit still for a second.
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2 comments: First- I don't' think encouraging your son will really make that much of a difference. It's strange, they just all of a sudden decide they are going to walk. Second comment - I disagree that it's harder when they start walking. I found it easier. They can easily get what and where they want, so less frustration and exploring keeps them occupied.
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ita. 13 mo is not yet walking and it's a pain.
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My son starting walking at exactly 14 months. For months he pulled himself up, did squats, etc., didn't seem like he was making any progress. At 13.5 months, he decided to take a few steps, did this a few times, then one night just decided to get himself up, freestanding, and start walking. It was as though something just clicked in his head.
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So far he has shown no interest. Zero. I tried to hold him up by his arms and he just sits down. OTOH he climbs over everything and tries to get up the stairs in a standing position.
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i actually found it easier, and they exhaust themselves from running around, so you get better naps and sleeping at night
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I really don't understand why crawling would be easier than walking. My oldest walked at 10 months... wish that my twins would follow in his footsteps. They pick up every tiny little goober off the floor and eat it, they are equally into everything as they would be if they walked, they move equally fast, and I cannot have them walk outside with me at all. Walking has to be easier.
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OP: Thanks for the feedback, everyone. DS is a crazy fast crawler so I already have to watch him every second. I just feel like *maybe* walking is easier so I can take the dog out to pee without hanging on to a 28 pounder. Also, my back and arms are killing me LOL.
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exactly
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he will do it soon.
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My dog will be happy to hear that. It was easier when the weather was nicer because I can just put him in my Ergo and we'd take a quick walk around the block. Now I have to bundle him up, put on my coat, etc... my poor doggie.
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My ds walked at 15 months 10 days. Just let go and walked. By 16 months he walked as well as his peers who'd been walking for 5-6 months. Please don't worry, it'll happen. Now I miss the days when I could plop him down and he'd stay there.
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104 replies
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11.05.09, 07:53 PM
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might be a stage that will pass; though terrible two's can start before two and last beyond it.
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Thanks, but he's really been this way since he was born. Very fussy and nervous and well, wimpy. Should I take him to a child psychologist?
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it really probably is a phase. btw. it is a hard thing to admit so good for you. Obviously you love him but I do understand exactly what you are saying. I bet he'll be great when he's older. Just try to work through it. Having him evaluated can
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^^can't hurt. Try NYU downtown. Great comprehensive evaluation.
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not awful but bear in mind that every character trait has a flip side. he might be a very sensitive and thoughtful person. the downside of it is that he can be fearful and emotional. and as a 2yo, that's really hard to handle.
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Can you think of any thing you and DH have done to contribute to this behaviour?
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We fight about this constantly. DH says its 100% my personality. I don't see myself this way, but maybe he's right.
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I'm not at all looking to blame anyone. But I do think we need to examine ourselves as parents first. You and DH are the primary teachers your ds has had since day one. It also may hold the solution, that if behaviour can be taught it can also be re-taught.
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I have 5 kids. Two of them were like this, the others completely the opposite. I swear they were just born being cautious, easily scared and nervous. Now they are very poised, nice, smart kids, and everyone says they wish their dcs will grow up to be like them. It is hard road, but work with what they are, rather than fighting it, and forcing them to do things that you know will be an issue.
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are you OP or a new poster?
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Mine is like that too. It is exhausting, and lonely, as he does not enjoy being around other people much. I do, and have lots of friends with kids, but he does not enjoy playdates that much. Trying to back off, and just do what he does enjoy for a bit.
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Thanks. He doesn't seem to enjoy much. We tried taking him on rides this summer at Sesame Place and he was miserable. Cried the entire time. So obviously he hates rides. Went to the children's zoo and he was afraid of the animals. He just doesn't like anything. Don't have many friends with kids who act this way. Other friends kids are so easy going.
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I know exactly what you mean. But I feel better now I have focused on what he does like to do. Which is really just simple, quiet, things that do not involve strangers. Going on the swings.(will not go on slide or climb on climbing frame) Sandboxes. Reading. Cooking. Playing with legos, playmobil and blocks. Feeding ducks. Playing with water table. I have also limited playdates to just 2 kids, so he can get comfortable with them, and then add one more a month...It is tiring, but my ped said to give him more att, then he will ask for less. I find he is much better when he has plenty of sleep and food.
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That's the other thing we fight about. DH says I don't feed him enough and he always is begging for snacks when he sees other kids having them and then shovels them in. I give the same recommended meals that he's been getting since he started table foods at 9m. And he eats like clockwork, always 4 hours after the previous meal. So food is not an issue. He sleeps 14 hr/night, and naps 2 hours/day. At the park he just runs around and babbles and points. Won't go on the slide or climb, just likes to wander.
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he is eating same food he ate at 9 mos? don't you give him snacks?
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He started table food at 9m and dropped baby food. He gets some snacks (healthy only, no sugar) but snacks are bad and I don't want him to be a fat child. He's not, so I'm obviously going to keep up what I'm doing. Its just that he always seems hungry!
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Jesus FEED YOUR CHILD
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Kids have smaller tummies. They can't eat that much at a time, so they need the snacks.
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omg, you are making this up, right?! I am an ED mom and this sounds like your problem right here. Kids need to eat!! snacks at this age don't make them fat! please see a therapist. I have had enormous recovery and no longer think like this. good luck.
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Give him more food. Every 4 hours is a long time. I give snack every hour or so to keep blood sugar up. Runs around, babbles and points? This is where you lose me, and it sounds off.
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When he was little we fed him whenever he woke up (bottle then food) and then exactly 4 hours later. If he woke up at 840, he ate again at 1240, and so on. We've continued this even after he stopped bottles. What's wrong with that? Snacks shouldn't be given so often between meals. They make kids fat.
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Look. It is too long between meals for a 2yo. This is anonymous, and I am trying to help, not flame. Do you have eating disorder? Is this part of issue with your dh?
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Doctor told me a long time ago to feed every 4 hours. So I listen to doctor!
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Honestly, do you have problems with food yourself? Is this something you argue about with dh? Is it a problem that has got worse since you went back to work?
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np: most books i've read have said 3 meals a day and 2 snacks. (toddler 411 is a good book for these sorts of basics imo). and snacking doesn't have to be unhealthy. my 2 yo often has raisins or fruit as a snack or cheerios, a granola bar etc. it doesn't have to be a cookie or candy
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you have serious issues, no wonder your dc does. let him eat, don't worry about him being fat. how much does he weigh?
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24.8 pounds.
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OMG, are you aware how underweight your child is?
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The babbling thing, at this age, makes me feel you should talk to ped about having him evaluated.
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My ped said that since he walked just after his 1st birthday I don't have to worry about autism.
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Oh goody. So everything is fine. But lets starve him so his brain won't develop. Better to be sn, rather than fat, right?
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As a NYC pediatrician, I can honestly say with great sincerity that I do not believe that any of my colleagues would make this statement. While there are some characteristics of autism that begin early on, the brunt of symptoms become more apparent well after the 1st birthday. And walking in the mean range does NOT indicate that the child is not autistic. You sound like you need some serious help in real life. Please seek advise.
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What??
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omg snacks do not make kids fat- where in the world did you get this mental idea? I'm so sad for your kid. Honestly they don't. CHeese sticks, crackers, fruit, raisins, etc they need snacks and there are healthy snacks. Even the occasional ice cream or chips.
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Agreed. He's definitely starting to show spectrum-type behaviors. Get help ASAP.
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OP needs help ASAP as does child. cannot believe you are worried about him being fat. get help
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Totally. This kid sound like he has some issues
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You feed him exactly 4 hours after his previous meal? Like when you did bottles? And you haven't increased his food intake since he was 9m and he's over 2? What's the matter with you?
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There is some food issue here with OP. He is 2. He is meant to eat plenty of food.
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Seriously, you are NUTS about this eating thing. Are you very regimented like this with everything in your life and with DS's? If so, I hate to say it but I think you may be contributing to the problem.
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Wow, only 2yo I know that sleeps 14 hours a night.
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sounds really hard. do you stay home? if so, you may need some regular breaks (if you can afford it). it is like a collicky baby, you'll need to have time off in order to stay patient and loving. the more you embrace him, the more likely he is to start feeling secure and less scared. it feels like it will never end but it will. try not to fight about it either. it sucks, just commiserate and try not to blame one another, it's just who he is for a little while.
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i don't htink this is unusual at all.
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I had a dc like this. Now much older and quite amazing at the few things he likes. It was very hard in the early years, but try to support his enthusiasms. Sometimes this sort of focus and reserve pays off - even if it means dc is the one who won't try things and seems like the hard one early on, when he won't do the dance at the bday party, or join the parade.
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I want the kid who gets up to dance and play with other kids. I want him to be happy and fun and the kid other kids gravitate towards. I want him to be rowdy and like sports. I can tell already that he's not going to be any of that.
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Not if you starve the poor kid, no wonder he is miserable and not developing. Jeez. We are group of experienced moms, and everyone is telling you the same thing. So listen. Do you want your dh to leave you, and get custody because you are abusing this kid? You need to deal with this, Now.
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It's time to turn that around and love him for exactly the funny little guy he is. Go with it. It will bear fruit. You cannot change him - but he can be the best kid of the sort he is, with your love and support. I cannot stress enough the need for you to let go of what you thought he should be.
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And by the way, I also ALWAYS feed my children as much healthy food as they want. They are self-regulating - so long as it's good food. Please trust him and his body more and stop reading books so literally. Let him tell you what he needs! He knows.
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np: this is a great answer. OP, you should be patient with your ds and let him take his time, discover things he loves etc. not all kids need to like sports and who knows what ds will be like if you don't put all these stressful expectations on him.
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Why do you want him to be such specific things? You are not a very good mother -- you sound terribly narcissistic. That isn't the worst trait in the world -- plenty of people have that problem -- but it doesn't make you very fit for mothering. You are starving your child, not only of food, when he needs it, but of feeling that it's okay to be who he is, which is, evidently, not a party animal. He will grow up feeling "wimpy" -- your insulting term, which no two-year-old can possibly deserve, however much he detests amusement park rides or socializing with other kids. I send him love and support and hope you get help figuring out what parents do to support their children.
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MY DC sounds like the ideal DC for you. Is rowdy, loves sports loves rides and zoos, Dances all the time. Likes other kids oh and btw I feed him snacks on a regular basis. Including cookies!!
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are you sahm? is this your only child?
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I was a SAHM. Didn't make many mom friends as I didn't connect with anyone. Then I went back to work and he was with a nanny, now in day care. Socialization not helping--he's the same way there.
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He may need more attention, one on one. A very caring nanny or staying home, if you wanted to, might help.
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Hire someone from early childhood program at Bank St. Or Montessori.
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I don't want to be home with him. I have no one to socialize with and my DS's personality is grating.
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ita. you do not need to be sahm, but your child needs help. maybe a home daycare with less children and more attention for your ds
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Try not to blame yourself. Try not to fight with DH. Try to find activities/settings/foods that will work for DS, but don't push him and don't overinvest in making him happy; there's a limit to what you can do, and stressing will not help. And BTW, D's issues might bear some vague similarity to your personality, but I doubt that DH married someone who was that unhappy, and if he did, he has only himself to blame.
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DH says my personality has deteriorated since having DS. Says I didn't make friends while on maternity leave b/c of my personality. At first I thought he was wrong, but maybe he's right.
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your dh sounds like an awfully big talker.
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He makes fun of the fact that I made no mommy friends. My other friend who had a DC around the same time made tons of friends. I made none. I live in an area that has tons of new moms and dreamed about having tons of friends and I really made none. I think my DH is starting to think something is wrong with me.
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Something is wrong with you. Get help.
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Your DH sounds like an ass. Is it possible your DS is scared of his dad? Who tells his wife that her personality has deteriorated since having his child?
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He's actually better when he's with my DH. DH is fun and outgoing. My husband is embarassed by DS's personality. Wants a fun laid back kid who handles adversity well. Ours doesn't.
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you need to speak to someone IRL. this doesn't sound very normal to me. partly b/c you are putting too much importance onto your 2yo's behavior. one or both of you is a little off, imo. is your ds in school at all?
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Day care, full time.
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do they think he's abnormally fearful? a lot of the examples you gave above seem very normal to me. and if it makes you feel better, i have a dc who was quite anxious. she's still anxious and needs to plan things out and think things over, but she's also very well liked and fairly popular. don't go overboard by expecting your 2yo to be a teenage "most popular" kid in the class.
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Lets be honest, the wimpy kids get picked on, bullied, and like bugs. I don't want that kind of kid. I want the cool kid. I know I sound ridiculous, but that's what I wanted. And so does DH.
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ok. you convinced me. fake post.
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I am starting to think so too. Or else she is completely crazy and real, and will end up murdering her little 'disappointment'.
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it's completely fake. it started off very realistic (well done, op!) and then degenerated into "my kid is a wimp" and the food issues.
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Jesus, after that poor baby was found today, I guess I am kind of a sucker for child abuse stories.
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np: this better be fake. if not, my heart really goes out to that poor kid.
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God, I hope so, too. Wrote a long reply but now am really hoping no one would be crazy enough to be such a bitch and then out herself.
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when did she out herself?
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please God, let this be fake!!
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omg. its not about what you want. its about creating a loving and nurturing enviroment so your ds can blossom. you can't make him into something he's not. just love him for who he is.
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I've tried to do that, but its hard.
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i honestly think you need to see a therapist about this. you are putting all this pressure and expectations on a 2year old. he is so new to the world and it can be overwhelming - you need to guide him in discovering it. i have a ds the same age and yes, its hard, but you are going to drive yourself and your ds crazy. go to therapy and in the meantime, try to chill a little when with ds and follow his lead, even if you think it is stupid or silly.
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A DH who tells his wife that is trying to get her help because he knows there's a problem. I'll bet her personality has deteriorated since having him. She sound slike an anorexic wacko.
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To the OP: Please, please, please get yourself into therapy. Your DH is trying to help (albeit perhaps in the wrong way, but maybe he doesn't know better) and is obviously concerned. While you're in the market for help yourself, GET YOUR DS HELP ASAP! Have a full evaluation, have a visit to the pediatrician, and BE HONEST with the doc about all that you do. Please, for the sake of your DC!
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yes, be honest about you worry about the child being fat and will only give him food every 4 hours
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You have an eating disorder. Mostly it sounds like you need some counseling for yourself but I worry that you have harmed your DS with your own anxiety about your personality and your absurd approach to feeding your toddler. Really, this is coming from a thin person with thin children, toddlers eat constantly. Snacks all the time. Whenever they say they are hungry, pull out the fruits, the veggies, the milk, the yogurt, the cheese, some whole wheat toast, healthy crackers... He needs lots of food right now! Get a clue please for the health of your tiny one.
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I have a graduate degree in mental health so I am speaking from some ed. and experience. You sound like you have psych issues yourself that you are passing onto your child. You are making him "nuts" about food; he shouldn't have to wait four hours to eat; he should not have to be begging for snacks when other kids are getting them. This is your first thing to accomplish - stop denying him his need to feel comfortable with food. If you truly care about your child, begin giving him food so he's satisfied TODAY. And see where that leads him. No wonder this kid is so miserable. Next, PLEASE get help for yourself; you need a good counselor to work with you on life issues.
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Also, you should know that your approach to giving your child your version of healthy eating habits is going to backfire. You are taking a perfect child with normal hunger cues and screwing up his ability to know when he is hungry. He is likely to grow up with the same obsession with food that you have which could either simply make him struggle with eating or it could end up encouraging him to overeat when given the chance.
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in our psych class, our prof told us there are three types of temperaments (something like friendly, slow to warm up, and avoidant...not sure exact terms) and when they tested people as infants then as adults, most of them retained the same temperament. so i really do think it's often genetic. some kids might get friendlier, but they are still not as 'naturally' outgoing as those born giggly cuddly babies. also, maybe the kid has low blood sugar cuz ur overregulating his food and he gets irritable.
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ita about the low blood sugar because she won't give him the food he craves. it's a crying shame that people cannot get "i am not a nutcase clearance" before they are allowed to have children. this kid shouldn't have to be put through this.
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She keeps saying that her son's personality is "grating". Did it ever occur to you that it's you that have the grating personality and are causing his problems because of your obsessiveness over food control. The way you are treating him is abormal. Give him good food when he wants it. I'm actually relieved to read that he's in daycare full day (and I don't usually agree with this but in your case it's a good thing) so someone is giving him some food during the day. I don't even know you, but I'd like to have your child stay with me for two months to get him happy with food and lose the nervousness that you have induced in him over it.
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NP: OP you say the doctor told you to feed every four hours. You don't seem to understand that even if a doctor did actually say those words to you, they were meant for a baby not a toddler. You are seriously malnourishing your child and causing him harm. Who knows how he would be behaving if you hadn't been starving him? He might act totally differently if you fed him properly. You know those other kids getting snack from their moms who are happy and well adjusted. Look to yourself, you caused this problem. Go get help right away. If you don't, I hope one of your neighbors or your day care call social services and someone intervenes to help your child. Your dh needs to step up and do something about this if you won't.
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I was preparing an answer about how you and your dh are stuck in a really pathological cycle here and then I read the comment, "I want the cool kid", and now I don't believe you anymore, unless someone else is posting and pretending to be you. Fake.
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oh, I really hope this is fake. it's breaking my heart.
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You and your dh sound like uptight control freaks who are placing a lot of pressure on an innocent TODDLER to fulfill your expectations. Get HELP, up to and including anti-anxiety meds.
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This is a fake post. Stop answering so it can go away.
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Voice of reason here: your kid is 2! That is a tough age and I don't think it has any bearing on how your DS will turn out personality-wise. Everything changes all the time. I think at 2 yrs a kid is allowed to be scared of things or tearful. Your DS is still so very young. Your DH needs to stop talking so much crap all the time.
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My son was like this, it will pass. He's 6 now and a joy. Does so much for himself, is happy to go on outings with any member of the family, well adjusted and fun to be around. Don't worry-mine was also clingy and whiny at two years old.
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My younger sister, the 4th child, was like this until she was 4 yo. Was pretty much a scaredy cat until middle school, discovered she was a champion runner and really broke out of her shell. Now she's got a phd in health care policy.
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At 2, it's not fair to talk about the child's personality. His behavior is a direct reflection of your parenting. Examine yourself and your husband, and how you approach your child. Then you will begin to understand why he does the things he does. Sorry if this sounds harsh.
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^^^ Signed - Practicing Developmental Psychologist who is tired of parents criticizing their toddler's "personality" without doing anything to correct their parenting styles.
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like other poster said, THIS IS A FAKE POST. STOP ANSWERING IT SO IT WILL GO AWAY
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how do you know it's fake?
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OP- what do you do for a living? Do you have any friends you can talk to about this who may be in the education field?
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You complain that you didn't make any mom-friends, yet you expect your ds to be very social. He probably does take after you. Do you have Asberger's by any chance? Are you a loner? I'm sure there are some very wonderful things about your ds, yet you haven't mentioned them, or you are not aware of them. He may be creative- an artist, musician, writer. It's oK to be a loner. Love him as he is! However, please FEED him!
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11.06.09, 12:33 PM
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DH and I are very relaxed about social situations and the germ craze, but even we stopped putting dd in gym childcare a couple of winters ago when she was little b/c she was constantly getting sick - they just don't clean like they do in "real" childcare/educational settings. There were noticeably fewer colds after dh stopped dropping her off there.
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Do us all a favor and stay home. Thanks.
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yes, but my kids are vax now, so I'm less concerned. I don't think it would stop me though from going to the gym otherwise.
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gym childcares creep me out. i just can't bring myself to leave my kid with those strangers. just can't. it's totally unrelated to the germs.
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11.05.09, 07:49 PM
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wohm. now wahm.
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i've been in and out of work since first dc was born. four periods as a sahm, i've done the wohm f/t, wohm p/t, and wah. bottom line is that there's no easier or harder. but there are pros and cons. here are some of them. woh gets you out of the house, gets you dressed every day, gets you talking to adults. it can also add additional stress (depending on the job), it can be really hard to juggle work and home, and it's very dependant on good childcare. sahm can be very fulfilling but also very monotonous and draining. it can be incredibly hard work or it can be very boring. a lot depends on the age of the child adn number of kids. i tend to think of wohm being easier on high energy women and sahm easier on people who can't run out to...
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work and then come home and manage the household. just the commute knocked me out very much. and lastly, bear in mind that both situations are made much easier if you have money to make your life easier.
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NP: The commute I don't mind so much. I can listen to my iPod and read. It's my "me" time.
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you know what is the toughest? living life as a contest. nobody has an easy life. you're not in competition.
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I think she is just asking a sincere question...
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I'm a WOHM, never been a SAHM BUT I would have to say that the age of your children is a huge factor on which is easier and as an above poster said, your financial situation and ability to pay for help (housekeeping, babysitting) whether you WOH or SAH
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mine are 1 and 3 and i am sahm, get only 6 hours a week to myself with sitters, preschool. it is so hard!!! my friend is wohm and she thinks she has it tougher. i disagree
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OMG I wish I had six hours to rest.
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I don't usually rest during those hours! that's when i buy groceries, go to doctors appts, pay bills, do laundry, etc. although i do all that with dcs, too, it's just easier to buy a whole week's groceries or whatever without 2 little ones with you. those six hours are not together, spread out b/w 2 different days. 6 hours altogether would be heaven.
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So why do you disagree with your friend? It seems to me that a WOHM would have to do all those things, too. Just asking. TTC'ing so I have no dog in this race.
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i just know that when i did work part time when i had 1 dc, the hours at the office were not physically draining like keeping 1 or small dcs. usually, a day at the office was refreshing compared to being at home with kids all day --- it's a lot of work and wears you out, i guess it's just a lot more intense to be constantly watching, feeding, playing with, changing, your kids, etc. no free time at all when you are a caretaker, esp. with demanding kids
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sahm with 1 dc is a lot easier than 2 or more. you never realize this until you have #2, until then you think 1 is tough. at least with 1 dc i had a little free time when she napped, after #2, no free time, never nap at same time, hard to get 1 to nap when other is awake, etc.
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done both. WOHM and SAHM with no help are both equally hard. SAHM with any help is a vacation. sorry, it's true.
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LOL. For my birthday I had a babysitter over for four hours while I went to the spa. I loved it, but it's not something I would do reguarly. Otherwise, why bother SAH?
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It depends on what you define as help. When I was a SAHM, I had a cleaning person 1x a week - it absolutely made my life easier, but not a "vacation". I also had a "date night" babysitter, who I could call on sometimes to watch DB so I could go to a doctor's appt, but that was it. DC has classmates whose families have one FT nanny per DC and a housekeeper/cook with a SAHM - that's a different story.
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I get that. It's good to have someone else clean and have date night. I mean the ppl who have regular nannies, I just feel like if you are going to do that, what's the point of SAH? Just my humble opinion.
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so you've been a sahm without help at all? what ages were your kids?
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Not OR but spa poster from above: DS is 6 and DD is 3.
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did you feel that way when your kids were 3 and less than 1? you had no help and sahm? b/c those ages are so much tougher than 6 and 3
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Well, it was harder, certainly, b/c DH works in BigLaw so I'm home by myself. But I always wanted kids and I'm TTC'ing now, so I'm doing exactly what I want to do and I am very happy doing it.
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so you think it's easier than wohm or have you been wohm since you had dcs?
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I WOH before DCs but have been a SAHM since DCs. I don't know if it's easier than being a WOHM, but I also feel like this is what I signed up for, so why pawn off my kids to a regular babysitter if I wanted to SAH? Don't get me wrong, my mom babysits for me on occasion and I need a break but I just understand the point of having a nanny when you're a SAHM.
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you made it sound like you only had help on your birthday. if your mom regularly helps you out, you are pawning off your kids to a regular babysitter. OP was about sahm vs. wohm, not whether a sahm needs a nanny. you have a part time nanny in your mom so don't complain about other sahms
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She helps me out maybe once a month, so more frequent than my birthday but less frequent than someone to come in all day or half a day every day.
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don't judge and don't be judged
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I don't understand where I judged? SAH with help is not for me, just as WOH is not for me, it's just my own opinion. I'm not the one who called it a vacation if that's what you're thinking.
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you are judging others for "pawning" their kids. if they need regular help, they need it. some people don't have the luxury of a mother like yours, and unfortunately, sometimes you have to hire someone to work regularly if you want help, esp. part-time. if your child is 6 and in school, and you have a 3 year old, you have it very easy imo. try having a 2 year old and a 1 month old baby, that is me, i am sahm and have part time help 2 days a week and it is infuriating that you look down on that. my dh never helps me with kids, either.
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Well in order for them to be 6 and 3 they were babies at some point. I did have to take care of them then and yes my mom helped only once a month then too
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great for you!
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and you have never had a housekeeper or someone to help you with laundry or anything? how do you do it all?
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Laundry in the house helps tremendously. I kept the house pretty clean with one, but
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^ oops but was hard with #2. Love to cook though so I did that
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I am OR. I work p/t, the days I am home I have no help. Nanny comes only on days I work. Both days working and being home alone with dcs are equally exhausting. I was on extended maternity leave, where nanny came on the days I would normally work. It was so relaxing. Older dc at school for part of day and nanny was with newborn. I read, watched DVDs, took walks and ran errands at my leisure. I was able to spend time with dcs one on one, at my discretion, which is significantly easier than balancing the schedules of 2-3 dcs, on your own. After experiencing this, I have a different view of moms with help, even 2-3 days/week, who don't work. They just have no idea how much easier their lives are than those of true SAHMs and WOHMs.
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Spa Mom: OK, I think I'm catching flak for your original comments. I also think it's different to work PT and be home PT, because you're getting the best of both worlds. A lot of SAHMs feel like they get no break, which you do in fact get on the days you're WOH. I feel like I get no break, too, but this is what I wanted so I am happy to do it.
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Sorry about that! People tell me I have the best of both, but it is exhausting nonetheless! Needless to say, I have total respect for true SAHMs (no help) and WOHMs. Gotta run home now and relieve the nanny, prepare dinner, and get ready for bedtime (see what I mean?). I'll try and check back at some point this weekend or Monday.
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Hey being a mom is exhausting, period!
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i think they do know how much easier it is and that is why they got help. happier mommy makes happier children
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I think WOHM is harder because we have to do everything SAHMs do in a shorter period of time. Just my IMHO.
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I don't know, it depends on your job. I'm a WOHM and my income pays for day care 3x/wk, nanny 2x/wk, babysitter most Sat nights and a housekeeper 2x a week, college fund for ds, and vacations several times a year. If I was a SAHM on one income (in this area) I would have many more banal chores to do at home. So I think finances have a lot to do with which is easier.
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Yeah but in this area, most SAHMs have help.
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what do you have to do in a shorter period of time that a sahm has to do? have you ever been sahm?
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Just the house stuff: cleaning, laundry. I SAH for a year.
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with one child? why did you go back to wohm?
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were your hours as sahm not more physicall draining as sahm? also, if you only have 1 child, it's not that different, but when you get small 2dcs as sahm, it's much more demanding, and i think the posts reflect that. both are hard, but a lot of it depends on work and ages and children, and if there is more than 1 dc
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My post specifically talked about having time to do everything, not the mental or physical challenges.
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I am a SAHM with 3DCs under 3 with no help and some days I just want to bash my head into a wall. Although, I can't imagine balancing their schedules with my work schedule would be a walk in the park either.
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ITA. I think this is not an effective question because first of all, it depends on your personality whether you'd be a good SAHM. Second of all, both are difficult, just in different ways.
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i feel for you and feel the same. i am sahm with 1yo and 3yo. i just think an office job and getting to have lunch and not feed other little people at the same time, actually go to the bathroom alone, etc. all day would be a cakewalk compared to keeping 2 or 3 little ones all day.
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ditto. When was the last time someone relieved you for lunch?
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actually today, and it felt so good. but first time in weeks. i've got to make it more a priority for my sanity
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You are me in a few weeks. Any advice on how to cope? Although I do get out and have a p/t job every Sat night for 4 hours, its my me time and its great!
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get part time help on regular basis. schedule a spa day at least once every month or couple of months
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much easier to be a p/t wohm than a sahm, in my experience. almost any job is actually easier than having small kids. i used my spare time at work to order online, talk to my friends, it was great.
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depends on the job, ages and number of children, your situation. no easy answer. if you just need some relief, get part time help and/or work part-time. going back to work full time wohm is hard, esp. if your dcs are small
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OP: after these responses, and thinking it over, i think i don't want to be full time wohm. we could use the money and it would be nice in some ways, but i would miss my 2 dds so much. i want to be with them the majority of the time. i think i want to try and work part-time until the youngest starts K. i just don't want to get out of the loop altogether as i do intend on going back to work some day, question is when
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What about these responses made you decide out of curiousity
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i think just reading about full time wohms and seriously thinking about how much less i would see my dds, although in some ways it might be easier, in other ways it would be harder --- esp. not being with them. i mean, i miss them now if they spend the night with my mom. i miss them when i do have help. i'd really miss them if i was wohm 5 days a week! also, the posts about part-time wohm seem to be the happiest
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I've done SAH, ft WOH, and pt WOH. For me it's a no brainer that pt WOH was the best and easiest combo - physically and mentally. I found SAH to be "easier" in the sense that it was less pressure and more flexibility. And the times I SAH with help were truly a breeze. But I also found it boring, repetitive, and depressing - but that's just my personality. WOH is a better fit for me. I do WOH pt b/c I have 3dc and 2 are school age so they need me around much more now (contrary to what you think when you have only infants/toddlers).
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how do you do WOH part time? do you mind telling what you do? why do the kids need you more now that they are school age? i'm really interested in your answer
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I'm a doctor and work pt. When I had 3rd dc I dropped to about 50%, now he's 2yo and I'm gradually going back up to about 80% which is my perfect range. Older dc need you there more. It's the afterschool homework and being involved with the day-to-day events of their lives. If you want them to feel comfortable discussing social pressures, peer issues, academic struggles, you need to feel connected. Any kind and responsible caregiver can care for an infant/toddler well. But as kids hit 6 or 7yo, they recognize the need for Mom or Dad too. Even a great nanny can't provide the same emotional/academic support as a parent. I suppose the academic issue could be solved with a tutor, but at $100 or more/hour, that isn't a reasonable option for us.
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ITTTTTA. I also WOH PT. On the 2 days when DC stays at afterschool and I pick her up at 6pm, she's exhausted - all she wants is to have dinner and go to bed and I hear nothing about her day (HW is done at afterschool). On the days when I pick her up at 3, she's more than happy to tell me all about her day - who she had lunch with, what they talked about, etc. I also supervise her HW and have a much better idea of what she's doing in class.
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for me, being a wohm was harder, but i didn't sahm before dcs were school-age, which i think would be tough. i had a very high-pressure job and no life outside of work. now i feel like i have my sanity back and with dcs in school some time to myself. ymmv.
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I WOHM through the school year and SAHM in the summer. I think SAHM is much harder, but I love that time with my child too. I love my work and have a lot of fun during my day, so work almost seems like a vacation. SAHM is exhausting, but at the same time it is awesome to get to see your child all day. For me, three months of the year at home is just about right!
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do you teach? that sounds like a good trade-off
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yes. i feel pretty lucky--it is definitely one of the perks of the job!
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what age group do you teach? same as kids or older, younger?
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college kids and grad students. they are great, and my schedule is probably more flexible than a lot of k-12 teachers (since my classes are infrequent). eventually i will probably need to start doing research full time over the summer, but for the last few years i have been able to duck out!
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been both. loved both. It's what you put into it.
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SAHM is tougher for me. I do everything I did before as a mom, but being in an adult environment from 7am till 5pm is so much easier than being with my kids all day (and all night). Don't get me wrong, love my kids, but I do more with them, in terms of stimulating activities, projects etc, when I have a chance to be myself at work first. But it's different for different people. The money also helps greatly with my relationship with DH.
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Wohm, hands down. You have to do everything and there really is no time for yourself. That said, do what you think is best for you & your family. It really is different for everyone.
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11.06.09, 04:37 AM
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why do you think he's gay?
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really, how can you tell if your child is gay? thx
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You know what? Forget all these people. I'm a 38 yr old, straight mother of two small children and I think much of this bigotry will die out by the time your son is ready to fall in love, gay or not. The generation behind us just does not, thankfully, have this kind of intolerant attitude to the same degree. I have an 18 yr old half sister and she and all of her friends don't get how 'our' generation can be so phobic, so anti-civil rights for all. And yes, this means marriage. Ignore these mean, intolerant people. Good luck to you and your beautiful son. With a wonderful mom like you, he will do just fine.
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I wish I had some more supportive word but I am 100% behind you. Love is for everyone, as corny as that sounds--why should only straight couples get to experience a formal marriage?
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No one is denying him the right to fall in love or be in a loving "committed" relationship. And you shouldn't bleed for him. You should embrace his individuality and personality. Why is this a reason to be sad? Everybody has burdens and hardships. Do you think every AA parent is sad for their dc?
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An AA parent has more rights in this country than a gay person.
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But open to waaaaaaay more blatant and subtle discrimination (no AA btw). And their difference is right there for the world to see, not discover. Who are you kidding. Except for marriage what rights don't gays have? Really getting so tired of this gays-as-victims chant.
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Gay hatred goes back in history just as far as all kinds of bigotry.
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again. a black person has BLACK SKIN. you walk into a store, its as if you are wearing a sign that says "I AM BLACK." some people ignore the sign, others (racists with "bad vision") translate that as "I AM A MUGGER, RAPPER, CARRYING A GUN, AND WATCH OUT, I AM LOW CLASS." still. today. 2009. New York. I am not talking KKK Alabama here. that doesnt happen to Gay people. yes there are bigots. but IT IS NOT OUTWARDLY APPARENT.
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and gays can hide their identity that means they are less discriminated against? WHat a crock.
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ITA--I mean, hey--if they marry someone of the opposite sex and make sure not to play softball or own too many Broadway musical albums and don't try to join the military, I hear they can hide it quite well!
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And just because you could pass (light skinned) does that mean you should have fewer rights? Discrimination against people for their color or their sexual preference (established over and over as inate) is wrong. Hey we even throw in there religion which is def. a choice.
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me too. I am not gay, and I am as waspy white as they get. I am anti-affirmative action. but PLEASE dont go comparing "discrimination" against gay people to discrimination against black people!!! one is blatant. and yes, whether we call ourselves all liberal and civilized or not, people do still discriminate, I see it all the time. I see black people walk into fancy stores, and the shopkeepers DO treat them differently. remember the Oprah/Hermes/Paris saga a few years ago? No, that doesnt happen to Gay people, because what makes them different (and might make other judgemental people look down upon them, righr or wrong) is not outwardly apparent. this argument is laughable.
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and as soon as somebody knows you are gay they change their attitude toward you. How is this any different? Sure, the gay person has the opportunity to hide his/her own identity. Is that what you are getting at?
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as soon as someone knows someone is jewish, they are discriminated against (maybe not so much in NYC, but seriously). so, we have hate crimes legislation.
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shut up. you've high jacked this conversation. you have no idea what it means to be black OR gay. so just shut up
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ITA. No one has to advertise the fact that they are gay if they don't want to. Its their choice. African Americans don't have that choice.
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I think marriage should be a religous ceremony. Religions could decide who they would and wouldn't marry. Government should have nothing to do with it. If we want to provide some legal rights for commit couples they should have a civil union -- gay and straight.
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I posted this Wed. With you 100%.
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ITA. I am the Jewish OP from those threads, who everyone thinks is so anti gay people. Civil unions=great. equal legal rights (insurance and all that) = great. MARRIAGE should be a religious ceremony outside the courts jurisdiction.
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Just to be clear, marriage is now a religious ceremony outside the court's jurisdiction. No court is going to tell your Rabbi who s/he can/can not marry in a religious ceremony. It is only the legal ceremony part where the state gets involved.
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right, take away that CEREMOMONY part. civil unions should be issued by states. "marriage licenses" or certificates or ketubahs or whatever it is you want, should be issued by rabbis, priests, pastors, imams, yogis, whatever.
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or: ship captains... don't forget ship captains.
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LOL--like "The African Queen!" I would love to have been married by a ship's captain...
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yeah, but it ISN'T--get it? Your religious ceremony has nothing to do with the gay marriage argument, though there seem to be plenty of Jews who disagree with you.
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I totally agree. I'm non jewish, non waspy, non AA and non gay. but let's have a little compassion here. Gays are HUMAN beings. they have all the feelings and desires than any of you have. Stop the hatred!
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Yes, and then please rewrite every single law that refers to marriage to include civil unions. That's what gays want. They want to have the same rights as a married couple w/o the need to spend a lot of money on attorneys just to get those. They want one legal certificate that shows them they are legally "married" and very entity in this country should accept it.
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Every government entity should. Why should tax laws car if the two "married" people are of opposite genders?
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Exactly. As long as every single law that is about rights for married couples does not include civil unions the easiest way around this is to just give gay couples a marriage certificate. That's the easiest way out of the legal mess civil unions bring.
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But the problem is the government co-opted the name of a religious ceremony. And because of that the "easy way" here is through a mine field. I, for one, am ok with taking the slightly longer route. The one that circumvents the minefield and arrives at the other side safe and sound.
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Why is it so hard to accept that the meaning of a word changes over the course of time? There are so many other things that changed their meaning but none of these things ever brought so much controversy. It is discriminating.
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OK. So your argument is that the meaning behind words changes and doesn't really matter that much... I go back to my original point. Call the legal part a Civil Union, let everyone else call it whatever the hell they want and be friggin' done with it. At least this way we can ensure gay couples get the rights/protections they need.
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Sure. Whatever is needed to make this all happen. It's just a matter of time anyway.
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I'm not gay so I won't pretend to know the feelings of the gay community (although in truth, can any one person pretend to speak for a whole community? but I digress) BUT if I was gay, the issue to me would be getting the protection and rights. I don't think I'd give a shit what the state called my union. Now I might care about my church and all that but that is a non-issue here anyway.
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How, exactly, would children naturally come from a gay marriage?
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go f*ck yourself, you are intentionally missing the point.
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was thinking the same thing. It scares me that I will have to explain to my DS why "[ ] has two daddies," which is particularly why we chose more conservative schools for our kids.
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I find kids have no problem with it. We have a lot of families with gay parents at our school. They accept it in the same way they accept that some kids live with just one parent, or are being raised by a grandparent etc. You explain it simply and answer questions as they come just like other things. I find it best not to instill a judgment about these sort of things in my kids because I don't want them to look down on others for these sort of things.
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That scares you? Boy, parenting is going to be a hard long road for you.
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SO, let me summarize you. You want the world revolve around you so you have not much explaining to do to your children. Right.
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no. I want my childrens world to revolve around values and the value system we wish to bring them up with. included in that is the fact that homosexuality is wrong, plain and simple. living with a grandparent isnt wrong. nor is living with one parent (we are not catholic) as sad as that might sometimes be.
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YOUR values. I am glad the world is not according to you and you alone.
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right. our values. our money. our kids. our choice of conservative private school that is on the same page as us.
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YOUR values do not instruct others what to do. So, your wish that there are no gay relationships is bogus.
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but my wish to say that my kids wont have playdates with kids who have 2 daddies, isnt bogus, and hence, I chose schools carefully. and found one that fits our value system. no matter how 'flawed' it might be. we are religious and our religion doent allow for homosexuality, which is a sin.
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LOL--cannot wait to see how many of your kids turn out to be gay and then you can figure out how your religion "doesn't allow" that. It apparently allows total ignorance and foolishness.
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you seriously think people cant make choices in ilfe? some are harder than others. someone with the propensity to become an alcoholic can CHOOSE to control when they drink and what they drink. they can join AA. hell, there are even drugs they can take to help control their urges. yes. if one of my kids said they were "gay" or had gay tendencies, we would fix their problem. end of story
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okay, now we know you are just trolling. or you are fresh from the sticks.
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you would "fix" the problem? Sorry--you are just hopelessly ignorant. Honestly, God help your children if this is how you think. You're setting your whole family up for a world of pain if you think you can control people to this degree.
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no, Im not trolling. I am just as serious about this as you are. I mean every word. you might find my views outlandish, but I find yours equally outlandish out in liberalville.
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hmm. worked for thousands of yrs just fine...
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Jesus was the original liberal, IMHO. Honestly, I don't understand how a bunch of GOP'ers have co-opted the radical who stood with the poor, the outcast, the stranger, the criminal the sick, the unhappy...and now these folks who claim to love him are picketing Nancy Pelosi's office so that people don't get decent health care, voting for the death penalty and for a stupid, pointless war.
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This is what I have to keep explaining to my Jewish friends to defend the increasing hate of so-called Christians. What happened to the religion of love?
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Why is someone from the midwest on UB?
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Uh, surprise surprise, there are people in NYC who arent bleeding liberals. I live on the UWS. many of us do not support gay marriage. I guess there arent that many of us on UB, thats all.
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That would be "bleeding-heart liberals" unless you're using some kind of Eliza Doolittle Cockney slang. Yeah--bleeding heart. As in Christ.
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I think that is great. I am bringing up my child with a moral code as well. But I don't for one second wish that other peoples moral codes weren't in the world too. I don't fear explaining to my child this is what we believe - not everyone believes the things we do. Our faith is strong and our "code" secure enogh to allow our children to see that not everyone lives/believes/thinks as we do and that's OK.
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oh you and your ridiculous values. give us all a break
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That seriously scares you?? I hope you don't live in New York. Some of DC (5)'s best friends have had 2 dads or 2 moms. What's hard about "sometimes 2 moms love eachother, or 2 dads love eachother, instead of a mom and a dad, and they also have families"? Very easy for my dc to understand.
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do plan to continue to dodge difficult issues with your kids because you don't have the capacity and humanity to tackle them?
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I wholeheartedly agree with you. I choose a Christian private school for my daughter for the same reason last year. This year we choose homeschool. I live right here on the UWS and wouldn't let my dd have a playdate at a home with parents of the same sex either. Yes I would explain, when the time is right what homosexuality is but I would NOT be explaining it in the context of acceptable behavior. I would be calling it the sin it is. I have had many gay relatives and friends and still do. They ALL know I think it is a sin as I don't mince words. I don't treat them any differently because of my beliefs.
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How, exactly, would children naturally come from an infertile married couple>
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It's been known to happen on occasion. Not the case with two men or two women.
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He's waaaaay too young for you to think he's gay. and he can have a loving relationship without all this make-believe family stuff. If he wants children he should go find a woman
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Bullshit. I knew I was gay when I was in kindergarten.
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Do you have any close gay friends? While I certainly wouldn't wish my ds to be gay it isn't the end of the world. Gay friends could be honest with you about day to day life and discrimination.
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Unlike anybody else who is completely insensitive, unknowledgable or intelligent enough to offer any helpful insight or support? This is where gays lose credibility. They continually claim discrimination as their sole domain and that the ability to overcome or deal with it is only theirs to teach. Again, everybody has burdens and discriminations to deal with.
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^^ btw, I re-read post and don't think you are gay, but still imply that you think only gay people can offer advice. sorry for any confusion.
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I don't think ONLY gay people can offer advise. I think white people understand that there is discrimination against AA but if I had an AA child I'd want to talk to some AA parents about what I had in store.
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I didn't say she should only talk to gay people from now on. OP is clearly concerned about what her ds will face if he's gay. I think gays could alleviate some of these fears. I don't know how this makes gays lose credibility since I, a heterosexual, suggested it.
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I think its laughable that you bring God into this equation when like seriously, you kinda know what God says about homosexuality. Sorry, just stating the facts. right there in leviticus.
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If God is against homosexuality, why did God create them? I'm not religious at all and not against homosexuality.
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OMG. If God is against murderers, why did he create them? I AM NOT EQUATING THE TWO SO DONT START TELLING ME I AM EIFFEL TOWER/DOLPHIN MOM. IM NOT. but you can make that argument about any "sin." why do good things happen to bad people. why do bad things happen to good people. why do we die. come on.
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What you're saying is as if homosexuals have a choice and also assume it is a sin to be a homosexual. Murders are not born to be murderers like homosexuals are born biologically attracted to the same sex. Your logic is completely flawed.
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Yeah, that sounds really scientific. Did it say murders are born to be murderers? Are you a religious fanatic or something?
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being an Orthodox Jew doesnt make me a fanatic.
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and by the way, I completed 4 years of post-college medical education, and a hellish residency. so dont pretend to tell me that because you feel bad for your gay neighbor, you know more about "human biology" than all the neurologists and psychiatrists out there do.
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If all the neurologists and psychiatrists out there know about "human biology" so well, why do we have all these problems? Everything must be crystal clear to them and they must know all the solutions to the problems!
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you are deliberately missing my point. which is: you can attribute ANYTHING to being "biologically wired" like that. alcoholism right? does that mean if you kill 5 people on the taconic because alcoholism IS A DISEASE just like diabetes, its ok, because the poor mom was sick? being genetically wired for xy or z doesnt "excuse" you.
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Yup, right there with slavery and stonings (pro) and shrimp cocktail (against). Anyone who claims to read the OT literally is either an idiot or the world's biggest hypocrite.
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yea. right up there with "thou shalt not kill." where do you draw the line? I believe in capital punishment. those laws were enforced thousands of years ago, and are not today, because we have a different form of gov't. the bibles view of "slavery" is quite different than america's (specific mention of the fact that "slaves" must be released after 7 years, must be fed before yourself and your family, and if you have one pillow, it MUST go to your "slave" not you). you better bet ive never had a shrimp cocktail.
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ohhhhh....so the slavery in the Bible was OK because they had nice pillows and were freed after seven years? And remind me what we should do with the fornicators and adulterers--I mean, I hope you're not letting your kids know anybody who's divorced or having sex before marriage. You wouldn't want them to think that's NORMAL would you?
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Don't forget never sleeping next to a menstruating female! Or trimming your beard at the wrong time! This picking and choosing of "sins" is preposterous. Why would people be made to be attracted to the same sex if it were not biological? All other species do this, too. Are they "sinning" as well. Humans are so incredibly strange.
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give him 10 years!! having a sweet, sensitive, more feminine 9 yr old DS, doesnt mean he will end up being gay!!!
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I think the fact that you think other people should or will go to hell for their beliefs, which are dictated by THEIR religion is unfair. I have friends who are gay. I dont see a problem with civil unions. But that doesnt mean that to me, religiously, homosexuality is a huuuge sin. I would never, ever, say that out loud to anyone, gay or straight. But my religious friends all share my beliefs.
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I'm so sorry. I wish I had something wise and comforting to say but I don't. The only thing I can come up with is that your son is young so hopefully things will be better by the time that he realizes it and, by the time he is an adult, he might very well be allowed to marry. I see that happening within my lifetime and certainly within his. I also agree 100% with the people who said that the government should hand out contracts for civil unions to everyone and religions can make up their own rules about marriage. (And btw, I'm an atheist but I can't understand how people think it makes sense that their God, who so loving and wonderful and marvelous, carries this hatred for 10% of his children. But then again, religion isn't so much on board...
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DH here. 9 years is too early for you as a parent to tell. I am very sure my parents were afraid I was guy up to the day I told them I was about to marry a woman.
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Are you bi?
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Nope, not at all.
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bi in self-denial?
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Hi, I am 100% for the same rights for hetero couples and gay couples (social security, income tax filing, etc). I also believe that a church should have the right to deny to perform a religious ceremony for same sex couples. So here is the rub - how do we write the law so that same sex couples can't turn around and sue the church for discrimination if they refuse to perform the ceremony? I'm sure there is a way - I'm not an attorney - but as long as religious institutions are protected I say get on with it. And for you OP, by the time your child falls in love and wants to get married, I am 99.9% certain this will be solved and all will be well.
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Why would they be able to sue a church? Nobody has a right to a religious ceremony. I can't sue the catholic church for refusing to marry me because I'm divorced. They have their rules and that's OK.
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I actually think there have been lawsuits against churches for refusing to marry an interracial couple. Being divorced is not the same thing.
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I agree with OR -- churches are not democracies. Women can't become Catholic priests. They can discriminate in any way they want.
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OR - as long as churches are legally allowded to deny same sex marriage ceremony - I have no problems. I think the divorce (you can get married, you just have to have previous marriage annuled) and female priest are not the same issue. But why argue - I think we are all on the same side. Yea for equal rights, let the church decide for themselves.
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Don't worry, he will be able to do all those things, since laws are becoming more enlightened. I'm Jewish, and know there's a world full of people who hate me, but as long as not everyone does and I have my civil rights, I'm not focussing on those other people. Thank god he has you, yes, but he'll have other friends and supporters. Teach him how to focus on those, the best thing you can do for him. PS I love many gay, life-long friends, though I'm straight. Would go for the mat for them.
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NP: I agree - it's horrible. I only hope that I don't know any of those people in real life. And for the responder said "everyone has their hardships!" - of course they do - but why have hardships that are entirely unavoidable? If your son is gay, he'll certainly have hardships in life apart from his sexuality. There's just no good reason to make gayness one of the hardships. Horrible.
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Yes, but who says they're as bad as OP imagines? Don't you know happy gay people? I know plenty, and there are lots of other groups who are subject to discrimination. The happiest gay people I know, I think, have parents who love and accept them. So this child is on the right track, as long as mom can relax.
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I know many happy gay people now. The vast majority of them had a draining multi-year adjustment period of trying to come to grips with their sexuality, and I am quite certain that I have no clue about their internal battles as they came to realize that they will be treated as second-class citizens by some portion of the population for the rest of their lives.
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I hope things will be better politically by the time your ds is grown, whether or not he is gay. Right now I really feel for my gay friends in their twenties and thirties, who should have the option of getting married and having children -- its terrible that they have to deal with all this hatred and ignorance.
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I hear you. I don't have any reason to think that either of my dc are/will be gay, but I have occasionally thought about it and would be sad- not for myself, but for the difficulties they'll have if they are. I also wish we could just all get along, love who we want to love & get a paper decree if we want one. These days marriage is pretty darn disposable even for hetero couples so I don't see what the big deal is, but if a gay couple wants to declare themselves to each other then I say who are we to deny them their commitment?
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First of all there is a God and for the record God made man and them woman to be together. The Bible talked about a man lying down with another man as a sin so I highly doubt that people who try to prevent it will go to hell, since the Bible does not condone it either. The Bible actually speaks of it as "the end of time." Christians don't hate anybody but we believe that gay/lesbian is the work of the devil, convincing people that they are somehow different than God made them. The only goal the devil has is to destroy the way God wants things to be and this is one way he does it. Before you post about God and hell I would pick up a Bible and read it. I won't be coming back on to see the responses b/c I am sure they will be negative, I am ju...
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I am just telling you, for the record. I don't trust what people say/do, I only trust what God says.
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np I don't believe in god or the bible. It's a book of fiction in my book.
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nnp: i was a religion major. i translated the new testament from greek, and spent countless hours studying the old testament too. i don't understand how anyone who knows anything about how the bible was compiled could take it literally, and it truly disturbs me that people who claim to base their life on its teachings usually have such a shallow understanding of biblical history. i also think it is interesting that people like OR gloss over many of the crazy things while retaining a few convenient ones.
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nnp: thank you. The bible is nothing more than historical fiction.
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this always amazes me too. I find fundamentalists usually have a very slim grasp of history. Never forget one (who taught at a fund. school)who told me that the end of the world was coming because AIDS was killing so many. I said I thought that the Black Plague had been much more devastating to Europe since it wiped out 1/4 to 1/3 of the population. She'd never heard of it.
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Thank you for this insight.
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I love you.
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I minored in relgion as well, and I do take pretty much everything in the bible literally. different strokes for different folks. all that stuff about sabbath? check. all that no pig crap? yup. even the no sex when you have your period.
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np: even though many books that could have easily made it into the bible, but didn't by chance, ended up as apocrypha? what ended up in the bible was due in large part to chance and politics. it's hard for me to understand how you, understanding that, can take the content of the books that made it in literally. not trying to flame, i just honestly don't get it. and there are so many strange dietary things in there i'm sure that you don't do!
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NNP: do you eat sea creatures without fins or scales (ie shellfish or calamari)? do you make sure that your "clean" meat never shares a grill or cooking utensils with "unclean" meats, even when eating out? Do you wear clothes made of more than one fabric? Do you cut your hair or shave? Do you believe that adulterers should be put to death? And that wizards should be stoned to death?
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ITA. And it's also just intuitive. You're born gay. It's not a choice. God is supposedly good, right? Then of course he would love all people equally. If not, then God is evil. It's as simple as that.
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You are so creepy
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I used to think the intelligence level on this board was higher than most places, but I've changed my mind after reading so many small-minded posts on both politics and gay marriage.
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I know. it's frightening.
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No horse in this race but essentially you're saying, people are entitled to the gay population's opinion. Or yours. But if not, they are small minded?
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no, but your response proves my point. Thanks
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lol. I would actually say, 'yes' it is at the very least small minded to wish to deny people equal rights based on religion, race or whom they love.
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np: thinking you can "fix" your gay child is pretty damn small minded in my book
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Before the boards went national a few years ago - it was more intel. Now it's just a bunch of uninformed blow hards with faux outrage at all the wrong crap. Makes me sad for my kids and the America they will inherit.
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It's mostly a bunch of uninformed, unintelligent, bible thumping losers who have spent so much time locked up in church since no one else will have them that they don't realize that they're brainwashed members of a cult. They spend all their energies hating others because they're nothing. There's nothing inside which is why they cling to such a religion of hate and exclusion in the first place. They hate themselves and they manage that by finding people they're threatened by to discriminate against. People the world over laugh at them and they have no idea!
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11.06.09, 04:13 PM
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