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  • [-]raising a child in a tri-lingual household. anyone else with the same experience?

    13 replies [ Reply | Watch | Options ]
    10.25.09, 09:38 PM [ Flag ]
    • no. non. nyet.

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      10.25.09, 09:42 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • Little 2 year old girl (my dd's friend) is growing up bi-lingual and at 2 only says about 10 words and 1 phrase but hardly ever talks at all.

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      10.25.09, 10:46 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • bilingual here (fully fluent in both). My friend has a tri-lingual household, portuges,italian, english. They spend a month every year in one of the countries (italy / brazil)

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      10.25.09, 10:54 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • not yet but plan to try.

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      10.26.09, 04:32 AM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • My DS is bilingual. We have two friends whose children are tri-lingual. I noticed that in both cases there is a dominant language and the secondary one but the third language is much behind the other two. It takes a lot of discipline to do the tri-lingual thing, I think it is great that you can do it.

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      10.26.09, 06:37 AM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • That's my experience too. Also, I have 2 dcs and now that they are both speaking English fluently we end up using English more often than before. When they were little I used to speak to them almost exclusively in my mother tongue, but now as they speak English to each other I end up speaking English with them too.

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        10.26.09, 07:31 AM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • do you have a question?

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      10.26.09, 07:26 AM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • my cousin and her dh speak three languages but only taught the dcs two (italian and english) so they can speak privately to each other in the third (french)!

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      10.26.09, 07:45 AM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • lol I hope they do not rely too often on this. My parents used to speak to eachother in dutch (they are from Holland) in front of us all the time thinking we couldnt understand them, and though none of us could actually speak dutch they must have done it too often because we learned to understand them.

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        10.27.09, 03:42 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • We don't have a choice about the three languages. Its just a matter of fact in our household (mother's native lang, father's native lang and English, the common language). Dc is slow to speak but he understands everything we say. Its very difficult and we don't have a lot of people around us in the same situation. We make sure to speak exclusively in our native language to dc.

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      10.27.09, 03:21 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • Yes and I know many others. In our case DH speaks 4 languages fluently (European). We lived in Europe until recently so DS is trilingual. I know many others (Americans) as well. One family has an English dad, Chinese mom (WOHM) and live-in (frail) Grandma, and Spanish nanny. The kid didn't talk until 18 months but then was fluent in English, Spanish, Cantonese and Mandarin. Other kids we know also speak 3. It's just a matter of how many people spend time with the kid and what languages they speak. The real challenge is getting them to read equally well in all three (my DC reads best in English at this point, but we still work on reading in the other 2)

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      10.27.09, 03:39 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • uni-lingual here....scraping by to understand each other every day. Keep us in your prayers.

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      10.27.09, 04:54 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
  • [-]I was at the beach this summer and trying to get all the beach gears back in the car and my toddler started having a meltdown on the way to the car. He wanted me to carry him but I couldn't with my hands full so I ran to the car to unload and ran back to him (there were no cars around, just a small beach path, all within viewing distance) and this woman was standing staring at my son and proceeded to berate me, telling me "I saw that, you shouldn't have done that. You're a horrible mother" I scooped my son up, went back to the car and cried. Why do so many people feel like its ok to criticize motherhood? Of all people, other women?

    113 replies [ Reply | Watch | Options ]
    10.19.09, 04:46 PM [ Flag ]
    • why would you cry, though? the woman is obviously a nutjob... don't pay her any mind. people have said weird stuff to me and I just look at them like they are nuts, because they are.

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      10.19.09, 04:50 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • I know what you mean. If it's any consolation I think those people who get so heated have often been victims of child abuse/neglect and/or work in fields where they see a lot of it. So they overreact.

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      10.19.09, 04:55 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • yes, they are disturbed and have to feel better by telling other people that they suck. basically ignore. Especially if you knew you did nothing wrong ^^

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        10.19.09, 05:06 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • Next time you think about doing that, think about visiting the NY Sex Offender Registry. There are sexual deviants everywhere, even in the most affluent communities. Those few minutes that you left your toddler alone might have been his last.

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      10.19.09, 05:08 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • you are a nut job.

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        10.19.09, 05:13 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
        • And you are naive. I suppose you'll go right on living in your bubble until reality rears its ugly head. I feel for your kids.

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          10.19.09, 05:21 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
          • The reality is that a child is FAR more likely to be sexually abused by someone they know instead of a stranger. The reality is that while this mom was putting gear in the car and had her dc within sight - the chances a sexual deviant would come by, kidnap in broad daylight are slim. Very slim. Yes, we all saw the news about the child abducted and held prisoner for 19 years. So, in 19 years, of all the children in America, how many others do you know snatched off the street right before their parents eyes?

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            10.19.09, 06:06 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
            • More than you think, but even if it's just one, why would you take this chance???

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              10.19.09, 07:45 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
              • Do you know how many kids are killed and maimed in car accidents every year? A hell of a lot more than are killed by some sex pervert who happens to be hanging around on the beach on Nantucket or wherever. And yet you've probably put your kid in a car, right? Does that make you a lousy mother? Seriously--you're the one living in a bubble. Your notion of "reality" is based on your own exaggerated fears, not on anything real.

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                10.19.09, 08:27 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                • Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they're not after you!

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                  10.20.09, 03:51 AM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                • Statistically, this is correct. The chances of your child being abducted by a stranger are quite low and it will probably never happen to you, anyone you know, or even anyone in your town/city. However, to deny that these things DO happen and that it CAN happen to your child is what's called living in denial. The more you know, the better you do. Parents do not have to go around living in fear that someone is going to snatch their child, but they should acknowledge that it could happen and make their parenting choices accordingly. Life is all about calculated risk, but to deny those risks is risky.

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                  10.20.09, 07:15 AM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • you are a paranoid freak. Parents have got to stop living and instilling fear of sexual predators behind every corner.

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        10.19.09, 05:16 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • Someone had crazy for breakfast today...

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        10.19.09, 05:16 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • I think you found your weirdo on the beach.

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        10.19.09, 05:19 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
        • That's right. I'm the one with the .357 at home. But my dc won't be a victim like yours will.

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          10.19.09, 05:25 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
          • LOL!! Why don't you try reading the statistics about kids who live in homes with guns? Oh, and maybe the ones about how effective guns at home actually are against home invaders, criminals, etc. I'll give you a hint--not very.

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            10.19.09, 08:29 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
            • NP: If you take suicide out of those statistics, guns in the home are not anywhere near as risky to the gun owner as the naysayers would have you believe. I don't advocate anyone getting a gun who doesn't train with it and doesn't treat it with respect. But the misinformation in this area is pretty overwhelming (on both sides.)

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              10.20.09, 06:32 AM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • come on lady (or dude), she had her eyes on the kid the whole time... its okay to be careful but its nutty to be paranoid...

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        10.19.09, 05:20 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
        • Bulls**t. There's no way that OP was loading beach gear into the car with her eyes on her son the whole time. Do you have any idea how quickly a child can be led away or forcibly taken?

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          10.19.09, 05:24 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
          • Hmm, if i were her, i would just quickly unload the stuff (and she said she unloaded) by the car and not "loading the stuff to the car" while keeping an eye on him. Normal mother's actions. So if you think she just wasn't looking at him at all all those minutes, you seriously don't know what you are talking about.

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            10.19.09, 05:27 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • np: i'm a HUGE advocate of safety issues, esp around leaving kids alone and water safety. big defender of not leaving kids alone while you run errands on the recent thread. BUT this is ridiculous. THe op clearly stated she her son was "within viewing distance" the whole time.

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        10.19.09, 05:56 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • I call FAKE!!!!!!!!!!!!

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        10.19.09, 05:58 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • it was that woman's problem. poor her.

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      10.19.09, 05:16 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • Women, generally, are nasty to each other. I think it's hard-wired, and while it's possible to have good friends, it takes a tremendous amount of work and focus to overcome your predisposition to be mean to other women.

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      10.19.09, 05:20 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • I don't have a predisposition to mean to anyone.

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        10.19.09, 05:22 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
        • I think it's a survival of the race type-of-thing. Women view other women as a threat.

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          10.19.09, 05:24 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
          • That's true, but men view other men as a threat too. Come on, in the past men would raid other villages and kill all the men in order to get the women.

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            10.20.09, 01:07 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
        • me neither. and i think it's pretty destructive to insist we all hate each other.

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          10.19.09, 05:27 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
          • me too. While I have met plenty of insecure woman who do dislike and are threatened by others, to try and claim it is biological is just plain silly. Glad I got the friendly gene!

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            10.19.09, 06:08 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
            • I think it has less to do with demeanor, and more to do with competition. Perhaps you are not a competitive person.

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              10.19.09, 06:11 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
              • I'm probably one of the most competitive people you will ever meet. But competition in a good way not in a life sense.

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                10.19.09, 06:17 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                • Then I think you're not being truthful with yourself.

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                  10.19.09, 06:22 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                  • I gotta laugh, who are you? Do you see how odd it is for you to try an analyze a person you don't know on an internet message board from a couple of sentences? Come on... Have a nice night.

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                    10.19.09, 06:27 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                • You're competitive "in a good way?' I would just like to see you try to define that.

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                  10.19.09, 06:31 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                  • It's easy. I'm an athlete.

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                    10.19.09, 07:02 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                    • How long did it take you to come up with that? Just face it, if you're competitive, it's part of your personality. It's not something you turn on and off. Most NYers are competitive. There really is no definition of good or bad competitiveness because it's all subjective. You may have enough self-esteem not to judge other women on a day-in/day-out basis, but I would bet that you are threatened by women who seem to have as much, or more than you do. It's completely natural, whether you're a nice person or not.

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                      10.19.09, 07:08 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                      • you would lose your money - now instead of me guessing why you would call me a liar about what I do and me guessing why you are so heavily invested in convincing me (or you) that I am naturally threatened by women - why not just tell me why this is so very important to you. Does it make you feel more "normal" because you feel this way?

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                        10.19.09, 07:19 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                        • For someone who is never threatened by and is friendly to all other women, you are certainly getting worked up.

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                          10.19.09, 07:26 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                        • actually, I'm not - but nice try

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                          10.19.09, 07:33 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                        • I guess you are not going to asnwer my questions. I do hope that you meant a woman irl that is not threatened by you or any other and you see that there is more than one way to live your life. I think you might really enjoying seeing that. 'Night

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                          10.19.09, 07:43 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                      • forgot - I'm not materialistic either. Who cares if another person has more or less than you? There will always be someone in both categories.

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                        10.19.09, 07:22 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                      • and one more - there ABSOLUTELY is a difference between healthy and unhealthy competition. I wish I could explain the difference to you - but from what you've been saying, I'm not really sure I can.

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                        10.19.09, 07:23 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                      • read your post once more, and yes, the one thing I agree with you on is I am competitive. I actually told you that I was most likely one of the most competitive people you will ever meet. Nothing wrong with healty competition. It's great actually. I don't think there has ever been a successful athlete that didn't have a competitive spirit.

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                        10.19.09, 07:26 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • that's a sad way of thinking... i never thought of that, but if you think so, and if you are a woman, then you probably act that way yourself. but not everyone is like that. Although I understand where I might get that kind of idea, but it is the society, the competition, the standards, whatnot, that forces many to act in certain way, and not predisposition IMHO.

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        10.19.09, 05:23 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • OR: I'm surprised, on UB of all places, that this theory is so hard for people to grasp. In nature, there are many species where female animals are the more aggressive sex. In most primates,competitive interaction between females is a well-documented characteristic. Do you think men would sit around and trash each other on a website the same way the women do here?

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        10.19.09, 05:39 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • I think you are totally right, I never saw someone put it so bluntly, there's always the sisterhood stuff, but I think it's true. I think as we get older, we start to come from a place of "I don't like you, until I like you". Scratch that, it's not when we get older, remember the bitch face in a bar? I have lovely women friends who I trust and would do so much for, but the new women I meet take a long time to become friends, it seems to start out hostile until we realize we have something in common.

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        10.19.09, 07:27 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
        • np: I think women are MUCH more reserved than men when meeting initially, almost as though they are sizing up the other woman (is she genuine? is she a b*tch? can she be trusted?) Men don't seem to process this stuff- they just lay their true selves out, and either they like the guy or they don't.

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          10.19.09, 08:08 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
          • ITA, and we wear whatever our worry is, "does she think I'm too fat? too sloppy? too slow? too dull? too boring? too aggressive?. . ."

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            10.19.09, 08:24 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • If this woman was standing near your son close enough to berate you when you got back to him, when did you initially see her? If you couldn't see her when you say you could see your son the entire time I think she might have a point.

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      10.19.09, 05:22 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • I agree. I think the proper thing to do would have been to put down the beach gear, take ds to the car, strap him in his seat, lock the door (crack the windows, of course) and run back for the gear, which could be loaded into the car with ds safe inside.

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        10.19.09, 05:36 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • why are you obsessing about something that happened this past summer? if women who bark at strangers about their parenting skills are nuts, so are women who can't forget a woman who barked at her about her parenting skills.

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      10.19.09, 05:23 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • I probably wouldn't have cried if I weren't already so exhausted (heat, toddler meltdown, argument with husband etc). Having said that, I remember I was so shocked that this stupid woman, in an instant, made me feel so trashy, when I am an educated, informed, loving and caring mother. Just reminded me of the fragile state of motherhood and how under appreciated we are. No one sings our praise, but they are sure as hell quick to point out what we do wrong.

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      10.19.09, 05:29 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • I think people "sing our praises" everything they say your son is nice, or polite, or give you a smile when he does something like attempt to open a door for someone else.

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        10.19.09, 05:35 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
        • they're complimenting your child. they're not telling you what a great mother you are. there's a difference. i agree that people are quick to criticize mothers.

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          10.20.09, 06:24 AM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • I have more stories like that than I could ever recall - including one where a man yelled at me for disciplining my dc in a restaurant, while his dd terrorized every table. If you're ever feeling empowered enough to say something, the only thing I ever came up with- and only had the nerve to say it once, that effectively shut them up was: "It must be exhausting to be perfect."

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        10.19.09, 05:38 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • I understand, I had a similar reaction when someone chose to pick a fight with me over something far more trivial. 3 yo DD was meandering around a non-crowded sidewalk and a young & able-bodied man may have had to step aside or something to get around her since she was walking a perfect adult straight line. Anyway we had words over my parenting and I was reliving it for days, even though I chose to engage with him and it was so stupid to begin with.

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        10.19.09, 07:02 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • anyways, i don't mean to obsess over the details. i saw the woman right behind us the whole time, she lingered watching my son's melt down. just was reminded of this incident when a friend of mine mentioned today that a stranger chastised her about her child's melt down, who is mildly autistic. a lot of the time, you just don't know the whole picture so you shouldn't say anything, especially to a mother, unless its OBVIOUS abuse. this board is so nit picky, seriously.

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      10.19.09, 05:36 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • um, you are obsessing. frankly, you're starting to creep me out with all your posts on this.

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        10.19.09, 05:40 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
        • i think this is fake and that op is a troll. she's clearly uneducated and i would guess visiting from babycenter to stir the pot.

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          10.19.09, 05:42 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • IMO, that's even worse behaviour on your part. You observed a stranger watching your son. You then chose to leave him near this stranger while you went to the car. How did you know she wasn't watching him thinking about how to kidnap him?

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        10.19.09, 05:41 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
        • ita. just more evidence this post is a total fake and that op is making it up as she goes along.

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          10.19.09, 05:43 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • Read "Protecting the Gift" by Gavin De Becker and you will realize your mistake and never do it again.

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      10.19.09, 06:27 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • I love that book, and I am in full support of OP. Tell me on what page you think she will find information that says she can't leave a child she can't pick up a few feet away from her as she puts stuff down by the car and keeps him in sight the entire time. Please, I have my book right here.

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        10.19.09, 06:29 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
        • Did she say ds was merely a few feet away? Okay, then try the chapter where the woman is shopping with her son and the man approaches offering to take him down to the arcade. Or, you can just take the message of the entire book and wake up. Her mistake was to leave her son while she shuttled material items to the car, which shows you that she was thinking someone might steal her stuff but never thought someone might try to steal her child.

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          10.19.09, 06:34 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
          • The majority of criminals would steal your stuff over your child-that's just common sense. Her child might fall off the curb and get brain damage too. I'm sure that happens as often as child abductions by strangers. Perhaps children should wear helmets all the time.

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            10.19.09, 06:47 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
            • Maybe so on the stealing, but what would you rather have taken? Why chance it? How can you read this book and not agree that op should not have left her son? I'll go a step further and say that op was angry at her son for his meltdown and left him there as a "lesson". Ha! She got her lesson from the wise old woman who let her know she saw her.

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              10.19.09, 06:56 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
              • someone else chimed in and did not put np - of course I've read the book. I LOVE THAT BOOK. And I know the part you are discusing about the child being lured away from the store. The perp actually befriended both the mother and the child (or tried to) before hand so that a conversation was started and there was an attempt at familiarity. Is that enough proof for you that I read the book. Got the story. Still, have no problem with the OP and her descripton of events. Sorry. We will simply do what all good readers do and take different lessons from the same words.

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                10.19.09, 07:05 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
                • I thought that was you, but no matter. You don't have to prove to me that you've read the book, I was just wondering how anyone who did would ever agree that it's okay to leave your child alone in the presence of someone unknown "behind" them.

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                  10.19.09, 07:12 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
              • np: how old are your children, out of curiosity?

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                10.19.09, 07:10 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
        • 1) we don't know that her dc was only a few feet from her 2) we don't know that dc was in her sight the entire time 3) op is clearly pulling our collective legs

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          10.19.09, 06:36 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • Ugh, that's hard. I've been in your spot many times, and curse dh under my breath for not being there (which is often). However, I somehow manage to bring child and tow all that junk all at once - yes my stronger arm now has a constant twingy strain and my posture resembles Quasimodo's.

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      10.19.09, 06:42 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • Some of you ladies are so uptight! I bet if this was a dear friend of yours recounting this at a dinner party, you would have all concurred and empathized. Ok, she shouldn't have left the toddler within sight for any reason but are we all so perfect? Give the woman a break, its not like she abandoned the child on a streetcurb.

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      10.19.09, 07:04 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • My question is: would this woman have said the same thing if it were a dad doing the same thing?

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      10.19.09, 07:28 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • of course not.

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        10.19.09, 07:29 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • No. She probably would have offered to help the dad with the items to the car. She would have never come out of her face like that to a man.

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        10.19.09, 07:31 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • Chances are, the dad would have been able to carry the kid and the gear, so this is a moot point.

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        10.19.09, 07:46 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • a dad here- I get tee'ed off on all the time. Everyone thinks it is ok to tell dads what we are doing wrong.

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        10.20.09, 06:43 AM [ Flag | link to this post ]
        • Another dad here. The real difference is that we don't care what other people think about how we handle our children.

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          10.20.09, 12:27 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
          • Orig dad: There is some truth there. BUT as I said somewhere else, don't do it in front of my kids. I don't care what Mrs. Palumbo, the old lady next door, has to say to/about me. But don't do it in front of my kids. Then it is "go time!"

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            10.20.09, 12:40 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
            • what's going to happen to mrs. palumbo the next time?

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              10.20.09, 12:47 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
              • She has since passed so any further joking would be in bad taste. (That rarely stops me.) While she was a hard and a mean old broad in some ways she was not a complete ass (and could be really kind in her own tough old-school way.) She held her tongue so I never really had to figure out what "go time" would have been. But she was on O2 so I'd like to think that in a best of three cage match, I would have taken her at least two times.

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                10.20.09, 12:53 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
            • I quite agree. Was thinking more about the looks or catty comments that my kids aren't old enough to pick up on.

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              10.20.09, 01:06 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
              • I had an old lady once berate me when I was with my first born. It was January and I took him out of the car and carried him ten steps into the bookstore. She went on and on about his not being dressed warmly enough. (He had a giant fleece thing with a thick hood but no hat (the horror.)) I said to her, "I know you think you have the best interests of my child at heart, so I'm inclined to not tell you you are an asshole. Have a nice day."

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                10.20.09, 01:13 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • Wow. I assume you have good judgment and make decisions that are generally sound. Even if you make mistakes once in a while, there's no reason for anyone to judge. I totally understand your reaction. It's hard enough to build confidence as a parent without strangers undermining us. I took our 4-month old on an emergency errand on a particularly windy, cold day. I was struggling with the bucket seat and the shopping cart near the car and a busybody, observing me, but offering no help, hollered " poor baby, what a terrible day to pick to take her out!" I seriously considered keying her car. Such a pointless yet hurtful comment. There are asses everywhere, most of them vocally so...

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      10.19.09, 09:06 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
      • I would have said "poor world with people like you who can only spout venom but never offer to help" (if i'd been able to think of it in time). That person was pure nastiness.

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        10.19.09, 09:17 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • I would have reversed the order, too. But that said, my issue is someone talking to me like that in front of my child. I'm a dad and it happens all the time. There is an old lady on the block whose two kids spend more time in rehab or jail than breathing free air. She routinely told me what I was doing wrong. Finally, I saw her without my kids and I told her my son was now old enough to understand her crazy talk and she was not allowed to talk to me in front of my children. It makes the block a little quieter but...

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      10.20.09, 06:56 AM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • why wouldnt the woman just offer to help you? I think most women could understand the situation and lend a hand.

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      10.20.09, 08:28 AM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • i would never have left my child...why not drop the gear and put ds in the car and drive the few feet and pick up gear...the lady was right very stupid thing to do your child could have gotten up and ran in an instant...

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      10.20.09, 11:03 AM [ Flag | link to this post ]
    • I think the issue is not whether the OP was correct in her decision-making process or not. Who knows what was the bestest course of action at that particular point and anyway, who hasn't at some point done something they later reassess as not their best decision? Jeez, even the most careful of us will eventually falter, and it's no stranger's job to point it out to us in a nasty way. Period. If you are a stranger and observe a situation that is sub-optimal, pipe up and offer help, don't pipe up and offer free criticism!

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      10.20.09, 01:21 PM [ Flag | link to this post ]

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