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Do divorced couples ever do therapy to help their relationship remain civil for the sake of the children? Or is this totally unheard of? ex-DH and I don't get along at all, and it's really hard for me. It takes everything I have not to say mean things about him to the children.
84 replies [ Reply | Watch | Options ]That sounds like therapy for you. If dw and I divorced, I would not do couples therapy with her.
[ Reply | Options ]op: Thanks for your honesty. I don't think ex-DH would be very willing to participate. I already go to therapy, and I still hate him. I thought perhaps if someone could help us communicate with each other, we could get along better. He won't communicate, is very rude, does things with the kids I don't approve of, and in the end it makes my life more difficult. I always have the bad parent. I want us to have similar bedtimes, food, etc.
[ Reply | Options ]My wife and I agree, "I'd kill ya before I set you free." but it is an interesting exercise. So here goes: I would probably react best to a note, "Joe, Joe Jr and Janey are having a lot of trouble dealing with bedtime and staying focused on school nights. It seems to be worse in the early part of the week because their sleep schedule gets messed up during the weekend. I've been really consistent with 7:30pm here. Is there a better time that we can agree on for your weekend schedule so that things are consistent in both of the kids' homes?" Everyone knows you are still managing his/their behavior, but it has the appearance of collaboration.
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What if the note came from the teacher instead? Because we all know, I get the phone call, "I can really tell ds hasn't had a bath this weekend." HOW EMBARRASSING for me! I have so many problems with what goes on at his house, probably why he divorced me!
[ Reply | Options ]OR: So dad picks up ds on Friday, drops him off for school Monday morning, and the kid has not had a bath the whole time? Does he want visitation?
[ Reply | Options ]Yes, on his weekends he takes the kids to school Mon morning. Is it really possible to have his visitation revoked? Not that I want that for my children...but I want rules of hygiene and health followed when I am not present. I'm very strict with bedtimes, meals, manners, etc and dh is very laid back about all of those things, but I don't think it is good for the kids. He also tells them I'm mean/bad mom, etc and they come back and say hurtful things to me.
[ Reply | Options ]On the weekends they should be able to go to bed later than during the school week I think. As long as it's not some ridiculously late time.
[ Reply | Options ]I don't allow for that, but I could see maybe a half hour, but when I child goes to bed 5 nights a week at 8, staying up until 11 is not acceptable.
[ Reply | Options ]np: it's beyond not acceptable, young dcs cannot handle that change in schedule. they don't sleep in or take a nap so it just becomes "lost" sleep. after 2-3 nights of that they are exhausted and it IS a problem the rest of the week.
[ Reply | Options ]op: I never had a bedtime, and was tired in school ALL the time. My dc's sleep so well. I know as they get older, I can't make them sleep. I used to wake up in the middle of the night to read, and later call my boyfriend...naughty things like that. I know it's all just a few years ahead. If they can sleep really well now and be focused and do well in school, that's important for now, we'll deal with the rest later.
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You want his visitation revoked because he does give them a bath?? Lady, you are crazy and couples counseling will not help you. If anything it will help your ex gain support that you are a demanding bitch.
[ Reply | Options ]If you read above, I said I was shocked that would even be a possibility for the issues we have, and I would never want that. I know it is important for him to be in their lives. He is the one that says bad things about me to the children, and won't communicate. I want to make our relationship as parents work for the sake of the children.
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I don't think I'm mean, I set healthy boundaries, and my children usually thrive. They are healthy, happy, rarely cranky and unbearable as a result of being well rested and eating properly. We also do a lot of fun things on the weekend, that they don't even realize the tv isn't on!
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My DH and I let his daughter go to bed at 10pm when she stays for the weekend. Her mother makes her go to bed at 8:00pm on weekends as well as school nights and honestly we feel that is too early for an 8 yr old esp on wknds.
[ Reply | Options ]Is this something you've discussed with her? It all depends on the child, but when ds goes to bed at 8:30, he wakes up on his own between 6:30 and 7 for school, which is perfect. When I have him on the weekend, and he stays up late, he still wakes up at the same time, but can be a little grumpier...but I'm calling 9ish late, not 10/11.
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My step dd says she is not tired at 8 and tends to wake up at like 3 in the morning because she is not tired. 8 is really to early for her. 9pm would be better and I honestly think her mother gives her such an early bedtime to get her daughter out of her hair asap.
[ Reply | Options ]op: Totally agree, it's an individual thing. But my ds sleeps 8:30 - 6:30/7 waking up naturally. Would hate to start having to wake him up, because then he's a bear! And...early bedtimes are nice, because by that point you ARE exhausted, especially if you have 3. But, early bed times make early risers...you need a healthy balance.
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OR (the dh): I was not suggesting (to be clear for all) that I thought that dad ought to lose parental/visitation rights. I was just wondering if it was OP's belief that he wanted them or not.
[ Reply | Options ]He actually only wanted visitation for the oldest two, a baby would be too difficult to take care of. So he doesn't see our 2yo often. I do take the baby over for afternoon/day visits, especially when gma & gpa are visiting. He doesn't cancel weekends on me often, and when he does, he asks to switch them, which I usually allow, unless I had something planned that I can't change. He does genuinely want to see his kids, which I am happy about.
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Happens to my dcs too, no hair washing, bedtime at 11, sent to school with swimming suit instead of underpants because they have no done laundry in so long. And stupid gf has a flea ridden dog, so they come home covered in flea bites, and they both refuse to admit that her lap dog could ever have fleas. Because no dog gets fleas on the UES, right? Unless you hire a lawyer for vast amounts of money, you are out of luck with people like this. And how do you prove it anyway?
[ Reply | Options ]Well, I can prove it because ds's K teacher called me to say he stinks and needs a bath!! ex-DH also has a new girlfriend living with him, and they just want to have fun all the time...pizza for every meal, tv all day. I have a girl that helps me out on weekends when I have all 3 kids, I might ask ex-dh if she can go to his place to help him out.
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Your last sentence sounds like you are a controlling person. I am also divorced, but I do not micromanage how he spends his time with the kids. I would hate if he did this to me.
[ Reply | Options ]I know it does. But pizza and bagels aren't acceptable foods for an entire weekend. My kids eat vegetables, fruit, whole grains, salmon, turkey, etc. I even offered to send food he can just heat up, I know that's a bit over the top as far as micro managing would go. That's why I'd like to find a common ground. All kids in bed by 9pm on fri/sat, no matter whose house, pizza can only account for one meal each weekend, baths are a MUST on sunday nights, no trash talking the other parent, etc.
[ Reply | Options ]Think about all the things YOU do that ex-DH disagrees with. Should he able to dictate to you, on your time, that you can't do them?
[ Reply | Options ]None of the things I do are harmful for the children. I'd be willing to say the tv can stay on ALL day if he would at least offer them something green to eat once each day. And I have never ever said a single bad thing about him to the kids.
[ Reply | Options ]Does he only see the kids on the weekend? They can survive without vegetables. I know this is not ideal, but eventually you are going to have to deal with your issues of not having complete control over what they do at his house. Look for the positive things that he does well and compliment him. Maybe after a while he will be open to suggestions.
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np: oh my gosh, you need to lighten up. no trash talking the other parent is certainly reasonable, but the rest of those things are NOT a big deal. it sounds like your kids are lucky to have your ex in their lives so they can LIVE a little! why not be grateful to him for giving them a fun time? as for the bath thing, if you think it will get skipped on Sunday, then do baths right before they go over there on the weekend.
[ Reply | Options ]^^couples counseling might be good for you--or even talking to the therapist you have now about these issues--so you can hear from a third party that you are being unreasonable and controlling.
[ Reply | Options ]op: I don't think expecting healthy sleep habits, proper diets, manners, etc is asking too much. And the things he says about me to the kids are so hurtful, and they repeat ALL of it. I tried saying "Daddy didn't mean that. Mommy and Daddy are still friends." These are the issues I thought a professional could help with. How to talk about one another to the children in a respectful way. And not to teach them mommy is crazy for cooking us healthy food.
[ Reply | Options ]Maybe you should pick the kids up on Sunday night or have them dropped off so you can ensure they get a bath?
[ Reply | Options ]op: Tried that...got the whole "you don't think I can handle it. I'm responsible enough, blah blah blah." He does want the time with the kids, and it is nice to let him do the schlepp twice a month. :) But clearly we need to have a discussion, and make this work.
[ Reply | Options ]maybe he keeps the kids up later because he only seems them two weekends a month and misses them.
[ Reply | Options ]op: He does work a lot, and can't see them during the week because of that (but that was the same when we were married). I would think the time spent with them would be more enjoyable if they weren't over tired. Oh well, this is a losing battle. I'm gonna shoot for sunday night baths and early bedtimes on sundays.
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Above poster was right. You need to pick a single (or at most two) issues that are most important to you. You cannot expect your dh to be a parent-clone of you. Eating pizza and bagels on the weekend is not going to kill your kids. You are not listening to any of the great advice you are getting here. That should tell you something.
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I think no trash talking is fair and I thinka Sunday night bath (or at least 1 bath on his watch) is fair. While I agree with you that the bedtime thing really throws off the entire week, that's going to be tougher. Forget the foods. Not worth it. If the teacher is calling you on a Monday after his weekend, let her know that and ask her to please call their father about lack of bath or being really tired. Maybe if the teacher is calling and embarassing him, he'd think twice.
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OP: Any suggestions on how to deal with our poor communication skills if we don't do counseling? Everyone seems to think this is the most important issue. And this is definitely the hardest one to fix. Nothing I am coming up with in my own head right now seems likely to produce a positive result.
[ Reply | Options ]Can you meet him just the 2 of you for lunch one day? Your treat. Then discuss the issues you have with me but in a as nice as possible non confrontational, non judgmental way. He may be more receptive if you put the problems you are having as in the "best interests of the children" Not as you micro managing his time with them. Also a face toface meeting is definitely more effective than over the phone.
[ Reply | Options ]np: ita. also, instead of saying, gee you keep them up late, don't bathe them, feed them crap, etc. say that you're worried that the kids seem tired and lack energy and that as a result, you think they may need more sleep then they're getting. ask for ways that he could HELP you make sure that they get more sleep. What do you think? always gets a better response.
[ Reply | Options ]But how do I address the things he says to me? I get the "daddy says you're mean because you never let us eat pizza" which isn't even true. I make pizzas with the kids every other week. But things like this. And recently, ds asked daddy why he lives with his new gf and mommy is still alone. I don't even want to repeat the answer dh gave. I need to learn how to deal with these sort of things, how to answer these questions for our dc's, not not hurt anyone's feelings.
[ Reply | Options ]This is a tough one OP. My ex husband also make snide remarks about me to the kids. I'm not sure if I'm handling it the right way but I tend to answer in a very positive way, "No honey, Daddy is mistaken. Remember we made pizza last week. Wasn't that pizza really good. etc. I tend to focus on the positive, but not put down their dad either.
[ Reply | Options ]np: turn everything positive. it's wonderful that daddy has found someone to love and who loves him that he can also share his life with. right now mommy is focusing on you and your sister, work and my friends. maybe one day in the future, mommy will find someone also, but it's not that important right now.
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It really is unacceptable that he is talking badly about you to your dcs. That really has to stop, that will be more damaging to them than all the other things combined.
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My mom was always the heavy. When I got older she confided that she resented my dad for making her always be the bitch. Then I got a little older and realized that that was only half of it. Dad certainly let her play the role of bitch but it was a role she relished. Ceding control is something she just can't do.
[ Reply | Options ]op: I'm really not trying to be a bitch. I just want what's best for my kids. I am willing to compromise on some issues, but we can't even have a civilized conversation anymore. I even encouraged ex-dh to let ds watch some of the baseball games over the weekend.
[ Reply | Options ]have you read this book, the Sandcastles approach to divorce for children? I think it is called that? It is specifically how to look after kids during and after divorce. We each got a copy after a reco from a friend, and it is an amazing book. If you could get your ex to read it, he would see the value of having similar rules at each house, etc, but most importantly, not trashing each other....because the kid always ends up hating the person doing the trashing. Weird science, but it is true. And forget about the diet etc, just focus on Sunday bedtimes and baths.
[ Reply | Options ]Thanks for the recommendation. I'll try to order copies of it tonight. My ds is 5, and he thinks it's funny to make fun of mommy. Dd is 7, and mature for her age, very serious. I can tell she is having difficulty with the divorce. She's a lot more like me too. dd#2 is only 2, and has no idea that anything is really all that different.
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